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Opportunity to point out the downsides of circumcision in class (open to suggestions)

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  • Opportunity to point out the downsides of circumcision in class (open to suggestions)

    ...
    Last edited by Anonymousrestorer; 08-17-2021, 08:01 PM.

  • #2
    Originally posted by Anonymousrestorer View Post
    it talks as well about phimosis. And it is like:
    advantages: reduces the risk of sexually transmitted diseases, inflammation and urinary infections.
    You mean the book mentions phimois, and jumps to circumcision as a solution? !?!?

    They need to add that amputation is a last resort, and that gentle stretching with steroidal ointment for few months nearly always resolves it. They should see https://tlctugger.com/product/phimoc...pansion-rings/

    Originally posted by Anonymousrestorer View Post
    I'll politely ask for permission to speak and explain the side effects of this irreversible surgery that we all know about.
    I'll mention briefly the downsides and other alternatives to this. Later, I'll go to an online forum of my class and post a short text (maybe with resources, I'm not sure yet, but it's common for us to post related stuff, questions and etc so it's a good place for further explanation) about this.

    It's likely that my professor would spread this to other classes, which would be something really good.
    That WOULD be good. But I think we need to be emotionally prepared for the possibility that your speaking will not be entertained.

    I would definitely limit my claims to things that are physical realities (e.g. the average adult foreskin is 15 square inches of sexual interface) or for which you can provide authoritative evidence (e.g. Morten Frisch et al 2007 found the foreskin was more sensitive to fine touch than any part of the circumcised penis).

    Originally posted by Anonymousrestorer View Post
    I had a friend that has this problem, and he told be about that, then I decided to look up in the internet for solutions that could help him
    Well, I think absolutely everyone would assume there is no friend, so I'd say drop the charade, and it probably won't come up anyway. But if it does, you very resourcefully found out about a way to reverse some of the damage of an unwanted amputation, say it loud, say it proud.

    If pressed, I suppose all I'd have to say about it is that I believe in the basic human right to an intact body, and that other parts, other genders, at other ages are protected. I think there should be no non-consentual non-therapeutic amputations allowed.

    Originally posted by Anonymousrestorer View Post
    What are the worst downsides this surgery has?
    That hits on why the disussion is so challenging. Some people rightfully will claim it didn't harm them much (that they know of) while others will say it was disastrous. That's possible because outcomes are obscenely haphazard. Nobody should have to live with the unintended damage you would see at these pages: http://circumcisionharm.org/gallery1.htm

    Originally posted by Anonymousrestorer View Post
    How has this affected other people's lives? Could someone help me please?
    In your situation I would quickly find people to interact with on Twitter. My own feed of Tweets and Replies will be full of platitudes succinctly describing benefits of foreskin and risks and drawbacks of circumcision. https://twitter.com/TLCTugger/with_replies
    -Ron Low
    [email protected]
    847 414-1692 Chicago

    Comment


    • #3
      Here is a good source for information that could be helpful:

      Doctors Opposing Circumcision | Facts About Circumcision

      I think the so called elephant in the room will be the issue of whether the foreskin has much value. In my experience, that typically is a driver in discussions/presentations like this and what you aim to do. As Ron said above, many feel (due to not having a way to compare) that the foreskin does not, and there is a lot of supporting but highly biased information out there agreeing with that position. And a lot of fear mongering about the bad things that can happen if a man is left intact. It is an uphill battle for you and us, and it is easy for many to see us as highly biased and unreasonable.

      So, if you get a chance to ask and make you points, my suggestion is to be succinct, refer to sources that have credibility, and use analogies that will open their minds to potential bias.

      For example, an often used argument is that male babies with foreskins get more UTIs than circumcised babies do. On the face of it, that sounds very reasonable. But if you compare it to female infants, the intact male infants are getting way less that the female infants, yet no one talks about the need to amputate or otherwise use surgical interventions for them. So it only makes sense to do it in males if you make the (often hidden) assumption that 1) the foreskin is not valuable so removing it is not biggies, and 2) there is not much trauma from circumcising an infant, and 3) there is no better solution and the this surgery can't wait. If the foreskin were valued the way it should be, the trauma of infant circumcision was admitted, and human rights to bodily integrity was actually recognized for this situation, we would not be circumcising infants using this to justify it.

      Hope that helps.

      Comment


      • #4
        I agree with all the above responses. I can only say for myself that the main motivation for FR was the total and complete desensitization of my penis by age fifty, but noticeably starting from my late thirties and early forties. My desensitization made sex unappealing to me until I started restoring in earnest in my mid fifties. Man, I wished I’d been really committed to this effort much earlier, unfortunately there weren’t a lot of manufactured restoring devices back then. Anyhow, better late than never. Good luck to you.
        Tugger1

        Comment


        • #5
          ...
          Last edited by Anonymousrestorer; 08-17-2021, 08:19 PM.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by greg_b View Post
            Here is a good source for information that could be helpful:

            Doctors Opposing Circumcision | Facts About Circumcision

            I think the so called elephant in the room will be the issue of whether the foreskin has much value. In my experience, that typically is a driver in discussions/presentations like this and what you aim to do. As Ron said above, many feel (due to not having a way to compare) that the foreskin does not, and there is a lot of supporting but highly biased information out there agreeing with that position. And a lot of fear mongering about the bad things that can happen if a man is left intact. It is an uphill battle for you and us, and it is easy for many to see us as highly biased and unreasonable.

            So, if you get a chance to ask and make you points, my suggestion is to be succinct, refer to sources that have credibility, and use analogies that will open their minds to potential bias.

            For example, an often used argument is that male babies with foreskins get more UTIs than circumcised babies do. On the face of it, that sounds very reasonable. But if you compare it to female infants, the intact male infants are getting way less that the female infants, yet no one talks about the need to amputate or otherwise use surgical interventions for them. So it only makes sense to do it in males if you make the (often hidden) assumption that 1) the foreskin is not valuable so removing it is not biggies, and 2) there is not much trauma from circumcising an infant, and 3) there is no better solution and the this surgery can't wait. If the foreskin were valued the way it should be, the trauma of infant circumcision was admitted, and human rights to bodily integrity was actually recognized for this situation, we would not be circumcising infants using this to justify it.

            Hope that helps.
            Thanks! I appreciate it!

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by tuguser View Post
              I agree with all the above responses. I can only say for myself that the main motivation for FR was the total and complete desensitization of my penis by age fifty, but noticeably starting from my late thirties and early forties. My desensitization made sex unappealing to me until I started restoring in earnest in my mid fifties. Man, I wished I’d been really committed to this effort much earlier, unfortunately there weren’t a lot of manufactured restoring devices back then. Anyhow, better late than never. Good luck to you.
              I'm sad to hear that it has affected you more extensively. It makes me.angry to know that still everyday there are babies being mutilated. But, good luck on your journey, happy to know you got some progress.

              Comment


              • #8
                Unfortunately, I believe that most human beings tend to be lulled into complacency…maybe we’re just a bit lazy as well and would prefer not having to think for ourselves. As a result, it can be all too easy for us to simply comply with the status quo and continue following this awful example started in the mid twentieth century…by doctors et al.
                Tugger1

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Anonymousrestorer View Post
                  About Twitter I don't really feel comfortable using it
                  Clicking the link I gave should not require a login, but I might be wrong.

                  Originally posted by Anonymousrestorer View Post
                  I hope that that information might save at least one guy from being mutilated.
                  I'd wager big that it will. The more people learn about circumcision, the worse it gets. Lots of people giving birth arrive at the hospital on the fence. You will arm a couple classmates with the tools and will to resist the illegal solicitation of unnecessary surgery.

                  Originally posted by Anonymousrestorer View Post
                  reduce the risk by properly washing your stuff, wanna solve that, teach children to wash themselves properly.
                  You can do folks a huge favor by making them understand that washing the intact male genitals is exactly as easy as washing female genitals. For diapering, wipe what's visible, rinse, and leave it alone. The AAP says for parents: "Only clean what is seen. Leave it alone. Only the owner should ever retract a foreskin." Caregiver foreskin retraction causes injury: https://tlctugger.com/wp-content/upl...ation-PFFR.pdf which can lead to the need for circumcision.

                  Originally posted by Anonymousrestorer View Post
                  I really had to vent out this discontentment at life.
                  Let us be grateful for the opportunity to change shitty things into better things.
                  -Ron Low
                  [email protected]
                  847 414-1692 Chicago

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I hope the boy in that photo will be alright. What is meant by a ‘well baby visit’?
                    Tugger1

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by tuguser View Post
                      I hope the boy in that photo will be alright. What is meant by a ‘well baby visit’?
                      It is a visit scheduled with the OB or more likely, a pediatrician where your baby is checked for conditions and diseases which can happen to your baby. Important to keep your child protected from the slings and arrows that existence on this rock can bring.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by admin View Post

                        You mean the book mentions phimois, and jumps to circumcision as a solution? !?!?

                        They need to add that amputation is a last resort, and that gentle stretching with steroidal ointment for few months nearly always resolves it. They should see https://tlctugger.com/product/phimoc...pansion-rings/



                        That WOULD be good. But I think we need to be emotionally prepared for the possibility that your speaking will not be entertained.

                        I would definitely limit my claims to things that are physical realities (e.g. the average adult foreskin is 15 square inches of sexual interface) or for which you can provide authoritative evidence (e.g. Morten Frisch et al 2007 found the foreskin was more sensitive to fine touch than any part of the circumcised penis).



                        Well, I think absolutely everyone would assume there is no friend, so I'd say drop the charade, and it probably won't come up anyway. But if it does, you very resourcefully found out about a way to reverse some of the damage of an unwanted amputation, say it loud, say it proud.

                        If pressed, I suppose all I'd have to say about it is that I believe in the basic human right to an intact body, and that other parts, other genders, at other ages are protected. I think there should be no non-consentual non-therapeutic amputations allowed.



                        That hits on why the disussion is so challenging. Some people rightfully will claim it didn't harm them much (that they know of) while others will say it was disastrous. That's possible because outcomes are obscenely haphazard. Nobody should have to live with the unintended damage you would see at these pages: http://circumcisionharm.org/gallery1.htm



                        In your situation I would quickly find people to interact with on Twitter. My own feed of Tweets and Replies will be full of platitudes succinctly describing benefits of foreskin and risks and drawbacks of circumcision. https://twitter.com/TLCTugger/with_replies
                        Steroidal ointment for phimosis treatment:
                        https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12010594/

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          In actual fact a topical steroid "thins" the skin, allowing retraction which makes circ contraindicated.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I did it!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Anonymousrestorer View Post
                              I did it!
                              Are you planning on sharing your recollections of how it went? I'd love to hear about it.
                              -Ron Low
                              [email protected]
                              847 414-1692 Chicago

                              Comment

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