Cyclic Tension

[parsecskin]

Hi guys, I Have been experimenting with cyclic tension for the past 2 or 3 weeks and all I can say is WOW! Hard Acroposthion, one of our members, a while back made what seemed to be an outlandish claim of just crazy growth. I didn't believe it either, but after seeing his progress pics and changing my routine to a hybrid using his advice by wearing my tugger an hour on, hour off and at the half hour mark on my off hour, do some manual tugging. In the past couple of weeks I have gained an amazing amount of skin going from 80% FEC TO 110% FEC...... in a couple of weeks! Simply fucking amazing! Friday evening when I removed my device and pulled my skin forward, it stayed there for a long time.
Sorry,, H.A., that I doubted you. Info, you owe him a big apology and I don't want to hear any of your technobable.

[OzVic]

Hi Parsecskin, Sounds really great, I understand cyclic tension to be the best as we are unable to balloon the total crap out of our skin with success like surgeons do when they force skin growth on OTHER parts of the body.

Please advise what were your conditions for your new found cyclic method- ie device / method / tension levels as many of us would also like to give this a go as well :-)

IT would be much appreciated by many, as cyclic tension is the holy grail for skin growth. :-)

[OzVic]

From University of Queensland Australia Wilson, Cameron John, Pearcy, Mark J., & Epari, Devakara R. (2014) Mechanical tension as a driver of connective tissue growth in vitro. Medical Hypotheses, 83(1), pp. 111-115.

Cyclic tension 10 Minutes ON, needs 6 hours OFF their study growth for connective tissue growth in vitro.
Wonder how close this applies to foreskin restoration for Maximum possible growth?

"199 Sustained growth and structural adaptation
200 In surgical tissue expansion, growth is stimulated by a series of discrete displacements.
201 While this may have arisen from practical limitations, there is also evidence that rest
202 periods between stimuli are beneficial for tissue‐building. The protocol might be
203 viewed as a series of “stimulate, respond and reset” cycles.
204 It has been proposed that rest periods and/or increasing strain levels are needed to
205 maintain cells’ sensitivity to mechanical stimuli despite their adaptation [42]. After ten
206 minutes of mechanical stimulation, fibroblasts in fibrin gel‐based ligament constructs
207 required at least six hours’ rest to recover their responsiveness to further stretching
208 [43]. Fibroblasts in fibrin gels have also demonstrated greater collagen accumulation
209 and increasing cell proliferation when cyclic strain is applied over a limited period
210 each day, rather than continuously [43, 44]. In a model of heart valve tissue
211 engineering, intermittent straining also resulted in faster improvement in structural
212 and mechanical properties [45]. To achieve a positive balance between protein
213 synthesis and degradation requires sufficient recovery time"

[Guest]

..............Sorry,, H.A., that I doubted you. Info, you owe him a big apology and I don't want to hear any of your technobable.

Haha, that's funny! What's that saying about water, and its own level?

So here's my reply: give it time, ace. Then say something. Should only take a year

See, no "technobable".

[parsecskin]

Hi Parsecskin, Sounds really great, I understand cyclic tension to be the best as we are unable to balloon the total crap out of our skin with success like surgeons do when they force skin growth on OTHER parts of the body.

Please advise what were your conditions for your new found cyclic method- ie device / method / tension levels as many of us would also like to give this a go as well :-)

IT would be much appreciated by many, as cyclic tension is the holy grail for skin growth. :-)

OK, here it is. I use a TLC X. I have an overhead anchor for my tugging strap above my bed and at my desk at work (I'm self employed and work out of my home) to which I have a small digital fish scale so I can set EXACT tension. I am currently running 9oz of tugging force. When I wake up I do a little manual to stretch out my skin and then jump in the shower. I put my device on after a shower. This helps to further relax my skin. I don't know about you guys, but over night my dartos REALLY contracts a lot at night and my skin is really tight in the morning, so a hot shower helps relax it. I extend the pusher to a taught but comfortable level and hook up my tugging strap at 9 oz for 30 minutes. Then I remove the tugging strap and wear the device for another 30 minutes with the pusher still set. At 1 hr I remove the device for an hour, but at the 30 minute mark on my off hour, I do 3-4 minutes of manual #3. Then repeat the cycle till I go to bed. I retain part of the night early on and most nights I usually wake up to take a leak at like 2:00 am (no I don't have prostate problems, I really gotta go because I drink a lot of water) and at that point I moisturize my skin with MRM brand MSM cream, aloe vera and some coconut oil all mixed together. I take weekends off but still do some occasional manual on those days. I also supplement my diet with a good multivitamin regimen and drink plenty of water. Staying hydrated is key.

[Guest]

From University of Queensland Australia Wilson, Cameron John, Pearcy, Mark J., & Epari, Devakara R. (2014) Mechanical tension as a driver of connective tissue growth in vitro. Medical Hypotheses, 83(1), pp. 111-115.

Cyclic tension 10 Minutes ON, needs 6 hours OFF their study growth for connective tissue growth in vitro.
Wonder how close this applies to foreskin restoration for Maximum possible growth?

"199 Sustained growth and structural adaptation
200 In surgical tissue expansion, growth is stimulated by a series of discrete displacements.
201 While this may have arisen from practical limitations, there is also evidence that rest
202 periods between stimuli are beneficial for tissue‐building. The protocol might be
203 viewed as a series of “stimulate, respond and reset” cycles.
204 It has been proposed that rest periods and/or increasing strain levels are needed to
205 maintain cells’ sensitivity to mechanical stimuli despite their adaptation [42]. After ten
206 minutes of mechanical stimulation, fibroblasts in fibrin gel‐based ligament constructs
207 required at least six hours’ rest to recover their responsiveness to further stretching
208 [43]. Fibroblasts in fibrin gels have also demonstrated greater collagen accumulation
209 and increasing cell proliferation when cyclic strain is applied over a limited period
210 each day, rather than continuously [43, 44]. In a model of heart valve tissue
211 engineering, intermittent straining also resulted in faster improvement in structural
212 and mechanical properties [45]. To achieve a positive balance between protein
213 synthesis and degradation requires sufficient recovery time"

Great post, OzVic. You've done this forum, this thread, and moi, a service, so thanks to you. Sad thing is, nobody's understood it yet.

And ....just to mention, what was revealed for connective tissue, the stuff underneath skin proper, is just part of the entire process, so ...... skin itself, with its own response time to the cascade of biochemicals which have to be secreted and carried to the site as a result of tension cycles, and the supporting vasculature, all of this has to form for it to be healthy tissue. Not quite as simple as the Ps and HAs think LOL. They have the luxury of just staring down at their dick and rounding it all off by only wanting the end-run. "Technobabble" just gets in the way of the end-run.

But if anybody wants to, they can go back and read my posts about tension, and you will see the word "cycle" or "cyclic" in most of 'em. Ain't my idea, and it definitely isn't HA's idea. I came down on the side of cyclic tension years ago, because that's what Science found to be true, not because some idiot on a forum did. And, remember, cyclic tension was first pointed to by Distalero, so many years ago; too bad you can't read all of his posts. He was right-on, on so many things. But then he knew how to read an abstract because he came from that world.

So.......once again, somebody lowered the bar, and somebody's trying chin-ups off it. But wait ... somebody raised it again. Breaking even, best we can do in the climate of internet posing, public education, and popular culture; we want our bars lower than chin level, so we can feel "tall" and "strong"; sad when you think about it.

Well........funny, too. Sad and funny

[OzVic]

Thanks Parsecskin and Info, absolute Great information.

You are lucky Paresec, being self employed you can attend to it so accurately in that way.
I too have have found a hot shower / hair dryer to heat up the skin is most beneficial in the morning to both relax strech the skin and get Blood circulating through the skin. In my case applied chucks DTR with max stretch and plunger extra depressed and locked in and let everything cool down while making breakfast seemed to give the skin a nice good stretch in the morning when it really neededs it after relaxing / repairing at night.

9 oz tension is about 255grams (just over 1/4 of kg for metric people) This ties in with NOT over doing the tension as there is no growth when skin is over tensioned.

Excellent information and thanks for taking the time to explain. Will incorporate many more of these ideas into my regime. :-)

[BackToNatural]

Hi guys, I Have been experimenting with cyclic tension for the past 2 or 3 weeks and all I can say is WOW! Hard Acroposthion, one of our members, a while back made what seemed to be an outlandish claim of just crazy growth. I didn't believe it either, but after seeing his progress pics and changing my routine to a hybrid using his advice by wearing my tugger an hour on, hour off and at the half hour mark on my off hour, do some manual tugging. In the past couple of weeks I have gained an amazing amount of skin going from 80% FEC TO 110% FEC...... in a couple of weeks! Simply fucking amazing! Friday evening when I removed my device and pulled my skin forward, it stayed there for a long time.
Sorry,, H.A., that I doubted you. Info, you owe him a big apology and I don't want to hear any of your technobable.

I'm glad cyclic tension is becoming more prominent in the restoring community. I too recently began using cyclic tension, manual methods 2 and 3, about 1 week ago. I'm already noticing huge improvements over my previous routine; I had been doing manual tugging for the past 8 months but in 15-20 minute sessions; once in the morning and in the evening. Progress was better than when I used devices for 4-8 hours at a time, which I did for the first 2.5 years of my restoration. Since switching to cyclic tension the skin is staying bunched up at the corona more consistently, and the entirety of my growing skin tube stays loose and stretched for longer periods of time before retracting, which doesn't happen often if I am able to tug hourly. I try to manually tug for 2-5 minutes every 1-2 hours until I go to bed. I haven't been keeping track of FEC or logging any of my progress sadly, but I can truly feel that this change is swiftly bringing me over the hump from CI-3 to 4. Currently sitting at 3.5 and am really excited to hear positive feedback on this method from multiple restorers. But like you Parsecskin, I have to thank HardAcroposthion as it was his posts and testimonials that spurred me to try cyclic manual tension. I'm just wishing I had done this from the beginning, and I'd probably be restored by now lol. But this is a learning process and we have to take what we learn and move forward! KOT

[Swingshiftworker]

Parsecskin: If it works for you great, just don't say like HA did that it's the BEST and ONLY way to do foreskin restoration.

The issue I had w/HA was his attempt to proselytize the technique as the "be all and end all" of restoration because, based on my own personal experience, I know that is does NOT work for EVERYONE, because (I've tried it) and it doesn't work for me.

BUT, as I've said before, there are many ways to achieve restoration and because there are so many different types of people, there is just know way of knowing which method will work for anyone in particular. So, everyone should be informed about and be able to try what others have claimed have worked for them.

With that, I have no issue. Just don't say that the technique that works for you will work for everyone one else, because it won't. You haven't said this but HA has, which is why I believe he got such a negative reaction to his posts; at least that was the reason I reacted in that manner.

[Guest]

So let's take a head count:

1guy who says it only took him a year to goal. And 2 guys who say they can see results in only 1 week! Has anybody heard anything more real than that! I'm excited for this proof!

Oh, and 1 guy who quotes another guy who says that you can't do anything but cycles, whatever that means. You can forget that. Can't tell if he's on board with this special cycle thing.

Oh, and 1 guy who gave us a link that says it takes a buncha hours for the stuff under skin to do anything after being pulled on. Growing stops for 6 hours after each tug?

Forget that. Doesn't sound like that's special-fast 'cause there's only 4 of those cycles in a whole day and night. I know this, I went to 2 years of high school. I know how many hours in a day, 24. (Sorry for all the techno numbers).

So tugging buncha times on something that's just laying there asleep and isn't gonna do anything sounds like that's where the special fast maybe comes from.

You know.......maybe.


LOL Funny.

Sad but funny.

[Swingshiftworker]

Hey, Info. It's the Net. There's all kinds of nonsense spread around about a lot of things, including FR.

If it's bogus, people will figure that out. This doesn't mean that we should let nonsense "pass" as the "truth." Of course, we should call BS whenever and where ever we see it but it really doesn't do any good to overreact to trolls, because what trolls want most is attention and, if you don't give it to them, they will eventually go away. Just my 2 cents.

[Guest]

I was entertaining myself.

But ok.........your point's a good one. Not to worry. But truth be told, you have higher hopes for forum bogus-figuring than I do. I think I've seen too much...................

[OzVic]

Now Now guy's, it is all good, why because all of us get to a point where the skin stops growing and needs a new technique to kick start it back into growth.
This is great that we can exchange ideas, yes its true what works for one may or may not work for others, but it is great to have this information available & to give other methods a try.

Until universities get funding and do proper research on the best way to grow back a foreskin it is all trial and error by us all.

The good thing is with patience and tugging we all get to well earned sensational result, compared to where we started out from and learn to spare those in the future from the utter stupidity that is circ.
If men were supposed to have less than half the skin on the penis God / Nature would have made us that way.
However we were made perfect in the first place and mans Satanic Ego to alter things is HIS image is where it all goes wrong.
Here endth the sermon :-) Keep Tugging as O.E.M. or as close to OEM is the "BEST".

[Camouflage]

Hi! I am currently experimenting with cyclic tension. What is your recommendation on the length of the cycle? I mean should I do 30 minutes of hard tugging followed by 30 minutes of rest, or on the other end of the spectrum, should I do 4 hours of moderate tension tugging followed by 4 hours of rest?

At the moment I am trying to push the rod of my DTR so deep that it becomes uncomfortable in less than an hour, perhaps even just 20 minutes. When it gets uncomfortable, I release the tension and give it some rest before putting the tension back on.

I have also included high tension manual sessions to my routine and it seems to be working. That inspired me to up the tension also with my devices. When I started, I tugged with the TLC tugger for 8 hours per day with low-moderate tension (set by the 4-hour rule), but I didn't get much progress at all even after 8 months. But I had very little skin to work with in the beginning, so my start was probably destined to be slow anyway.

[Guest]

You aren't going to like the answer, but ... all of the above. In other words, the old forum catch word: experiment.

If we go to science for an answer, usually what's referred to is shorter, somewhat higher tension cycles, but "higher" is actually characterized as "mid level" tension in the following information. Low tension got the lab guys some epidermal growth (they were also looking at blood vessel growth, as you'll see, because that's just as important, for them and for us) but in this case the time it took was approximately 2 days. However, when they tried cyclical loading it gave the same results in approx. 8 hours. So, our ears should perk up at that:

"After cyclical loading, the total blood vessel area measured in histologic sections increased to similar levels as observed in tissues exposed to continuous tension for 2 days; whereas epidermal proliferation reached approximately 58% of the increase induced by the 2-day continuous force regimen after only 8 hours""".

"Tissues appeared to react more promptly to cyclical force regimens. More studies will be needed to determine the mechanotransduction mechanism in skin, but in other tissues such as vasculature, cyclic forces are more effective in influencing genetic expression.21 Optimization of waveform may induce quicker and ultimately higher levels of cell proliferation and tissue vascularization when applied to wounds".



Now there are a couple of things to keep in mind:

1. They used continuous tension as a baseline. We can't do that. We will never be able to do that. They could, because they has the special equipment to do it. But that doesn't matter because what they found was continuous tension ultimately didn't work (in this and other experiments).

2. The tissue used was from mice, not humans. But it was an in vitro experiment, and, mice tissue is every bit as complex as typical human epidermis, with the exception of......penile epidermis has the smooth muscle dartos layer, so we have to throw that into our equation. This presumably means more time required for results.

3. To the question of "how much tension" (one of the perennial questions on forums) their equipment measured in tension values we can't simulate, ie kPA, or kilopascals. Plus we can't calibrate tension, except in a very rough, really random way. And they themselves say (above quote) that the "waveform", ie tension value over a period of time, still needed to be tweaked to find the optimum value.

4. However........(drum roll) "cyclical" in this particular case was 2 hours on, 1 hour off (but again with specialized, calibrated lab equipment).

So what's the upshot? Several of 'em.

What science does in the lab does NOT transfer to what we do in our pants . The Big D. said this many times on the old forum. He understood. Science is just too specifically focused because of the method used, and the narrow aspect of the subject explored (the hypothesis).

So....we have to experiment in our lab (pants) with un-calibrated "higher" (whatever that means), but "mid-level" tension (maybe that "sweet spot" so often mentioned by seasoned tuggers?), in cycles that we can live with from day to day. Maybe something from 2 on and 1 off, up to much shorter bursts of somewhat higher tension, say 3 or 4 per minute (or so), for several minutes, then rest, then back at it, then rest........and then..... whatever else you choose. Experimentation. We aren't science, and contrary to what's been tried on forums here and before, we can't really try to lean on anything experimental, just the known basics that science has revealed.

On one level, I really hate giving these specifics because they are an illustration, not a recommendation. You need to gently play with all of this for SAFETY'S sake. And that will take time. But, this does give you the illustration.

Here be link: https://apps.childrenshospital.org/clinical/research/ingber/PDF/2007/AnnSurg2007.pdf

I'll look for others, hopefully more specific to human tissue expansion.